Episode Transcript
Zoe Mock 0:04
This is cool. Yeah.
Don Mock 0:09
It’s like an actual mixing board. You can push buttons.
Zoe Mock 0:14
It’s very loud in my ears right now.
Don Mock 0:20
That’s what the headphones are for.
Zoe Mock 0:20
Isn’t it?
Don Mock 0:21
You can control your own volume.
Zoe Mock 0:22
Isn’t it supposed to go MOCK, the Podcast?
Don Mock 0:24
No, that’s only on the outro.
Zoe Mock 0:25
Oh, oh.
Don Mock 0:25
That’s only on the outro.
Zoe Mock 0:26
I always get it confused.
Don Mock 0:27
Alright everybody, we’re back. Episode 39. As you can tell by the intro, we have a special guests. My oldest daughter Zoe has decided to pop by and join the podcast, which is pretty exciting. Alright, say hello to the world, Zoe.
Zoe Mock 0:28
Hello world.
Don Mock 0:29
Hello. So, considering we have two generations of MOCKs on the podcast right now. I thought it might be interesting to do a conversation about nature versus nurture, right. And the idea of creativity and design and where does that come from? I think on previous podcasts we’ve discussed the inherent ability to draw versus not draw, you know what I mean?
Zoe Mock 1:03
Yes.
Don Mock 1:03
Like that’s sort of, we talked about Rick Rubin and artistry within all of us, things like that, right? So yeah, considering you’re the first offspring out the shoot.
Zoe Mock 1:13
I’m not out the shoot yet, but.
Don Mock 1:16
Well, getting close.
Zoe Mock 1:18
Halfway there.
Don Mock 1:18
Don’t get scared. That’s talking about, generational design, or where does design come from, or artistry and things like that? Do you want to tell everybody a little bit about where you are, or what you’re up to right now and what the deal is?
Zoe Mock 1:32
Sure. I’m the oldest of the MOCK offspring from, you heard from my mom, on a guest episode. But, both my parents were design educators. I’m a design student at Georgia Tech now, which is kind of a weird sentence to say.
Don Mock 1:46
Yeah. Pretty cool though, man.
Zoe Mock 1:48
Design in Georgia Tech. I’m able to hop on the podcast because I’m so close.
Don Mock 1:52
Yeah, totally.
Zoe Mock 1:54
People have mixed opinions about me being so close, but I personally love it.
Don Mock 1:58
I love it too. I love it too.
Zoe Mock 1:59
Yeah.
Don Mock 2:00
Who has mixed feelings?
Zoe Mock 2:01
Just when I tell people like, my dad’s office is on 14th. I can go over there for lunch. Oh, are you sure you want?
Don Mock 2:07
Yeah. Well, yeah. I mean, I did move 3,000 miles away from my parents.
Zoe Mock 2:10
That is a true statement. But, I’m in an engineering school for design.
Don Mock 2:15
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 2:16
I’m in my second year.
Don Mock 2:17
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 2:19
It’s very exciting.
Don Mock 2:20
So, I guess, how do we want to start? I mean, again, the show notes in the prep for this episode was..
Zoe Mock 2:25
There were none.
Don Mock 2:25
Remarkably deep. So, how do you want to structure today’s Convo? Do you want me to just ask you a bunch of questions about what it was like having two awesome, awesome, amazing parents?
Zoe Mock 2:35
Yeah.
Don Mock 2:35
Or do you want to hit me with a bunch of questions? You know what I mean?
Zoe Mock 2:39
We can go back and forth. You can structure it.
Don Mock 2:41
Okay. Alright. Well, let’s just start highbrow and go, hey, what what was it like having? You have two creative parents, right? Yet, you ended up at an engineering school studying?
Zoe Mock 2:56
Design.
Don Mock 2:56
Design, right, but design not in the traditional sense like we talk about it here on the podcast. We were talking about specifically what type of design?
Zoe Mock 3:04
Industrial design.
Don Mock 3:04
Industrial design and how would you define what industrial design is?
Zoe Mock 3:08
I think to do that, you kind of have to go a little bit back to growing up with these two designers, raising me.
Don Mock 3:15
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 3:15
And sort of this, they’re doing packaging here and there.
Don Mock 3:18
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 3:18
It’s very, outside of the box. And I very famously said that I didn’t, I never wanted to be a graphic designer ever, period. Funny now because I find myself doing quite a bit of graphic design.
Don Mock 3:34
Graphic design, as we joked previously, it’s kind of all over the place.
Zoe Mock 3:37
It is kind of all over the place.
Don Mock 3:38
Whether you want to admit it or not, it’s there. It’s in front of you.
Zoe Mock 3:42
But, I don’t know. To get back to that. I never really wanted to do the outside the package. It’s very cool. I have a lot of respect for it. Obviously, growing up with it, it created my livelihood, you know, whole deal.
Don Mock 3:53
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 3:53
But, I don’t really want to do that.
Don Mock 3:56
Yeah, that’s okay.
Zoe Mock 3:56
I kind of had this big, mind blown moment around the end of high school, like Googling different kinds of design school.
Don Mock 4:03
Sure.
Zoe Mock 4:04
Like kind of figuring out that whole shoe, obviously during COVID. Well, actually not obviously, but for those listening, my last two years of high school, I was completely online because of COVID.
Don Mock 4:12
Yeah, COVID effected.
Zoe Mock 4:13
Yeah, I was completely COVID affected, which is a whole different offshoot, but.
Don Mock 4:17
That’s another podcast, actually we did talk about that on the podcast, once.
Zoe Mock 4:21
Kind of figured out that, what is industrial design, what is product design, then kind of went down that chute of top ten schools for industrial design, during that whole thing? Oh, there’s RISD. There’s Oregon.
Don Mock 4:34
Well, don’t forget about Carnegie Mellon.
Zoe Mock 4:36
Yeah. Carnegie Mellon is up there. I really wanted to go there. Just, I don’t really want to be in Pittsburgh.
Don Mock 4:41
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 4:42
Oh, number three.
Don Mock 4:44
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 4:44
Georgia Tech.
Don Mock 4:45
Yeah, Georgia Tech.
Zoe Mock 4:45
I’m wearing a Tech sweater right now.
Don Mock 4:46
Who knew? Well, look at me. I’m wearing a Georgia Tech t-shirt right now.
Zoe Mock 4:50
For everyone, who can see us.
Don Mock 4:52
Yeah, living the brand. Funny story. I went to a store yesterday and I was wearing a Tech thing and the guy’s like, hey, Georgia Tech. You, you don’t like the Bulldogs? And I’m like, nope.
Zoe Mock 5:04
Yeah. But, to tie that in, it’s like.
Don Mock 5:06
Not that I’m anti Bulldogs out there.
Zoe Mock 5:07
Everyone and their mother that we’ve grown up with is, oh, my great grandpappy went to Georgia.
Don Mock 5:11
Yeah, sure, sure. Well, I mean, it’s very, it’s a big.
Zoe Mock 5:14
It’s very popular.
Don Mock 5:15
Prestigous, prevalent school here in the state of Georgia.
Zoe Mock 5:17
I wouldn’t say prestigous.
Don Mock 5:19
We’re not offensive podcasts.
Zoe Mock 5:20
We’re non offensive podcasts. I’ll have my own offense podcast. Sorry. To tie back all of this. It’s kind of a mind blown moment of, there’s this school three miles away that I’d never given a considerable thought to at all.
Don Mock 5:32
Of attending, yeah.
Zoe Mock 5:32
Of attending and the minute, it was three miles away, in state tuition, scholarships.
Don Mock 5:38
So, once again.
Zoe Mock 5:39
Industrial design.
Don Mock 5:40
So, what is industrial design? I mean, how is that different than graphic design?
Zoe Mock 5:44
Industrial design is so broad and vague.
Don Mock 5:46
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 5:47
There’s traditional industrial design. Oh, I make furniture for a living. I think that’s what you.
Don Mock 5:50
Well, I mean, in a simple term, it’s product design, right?
Zoe Mock 5:54
Yes.
Don Mock 5:54
That’s kind of the why things are the way they are.
Zoe Mock 5:56
Yes.
Don Mock 5:56
Why does this fork have four tines instead of three?
Zoe Mock 5:59
Exactly.
Don Mock 5:59
Why does this coffee pot look this way?
Zoe Mock 6:01
Why was it revolutionary for one chair to have bent wood and be able to manufacture that half a million times in six months?
Don Mock 6:07
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 6:08
So, that’s a very traditional product design. It’s very traditional industrial design. Where it started to differentiate is now we’re in the digital age, if we have this whole user experience platform, we’re more concerned with the digital rather than the physical.
Don Mock 6:25
Sure.
Zoe Mock 6:25
So, the schools of initial design vary in, are we teaching digital? That’s where graphic design ends up tying in more than you would think. Versus my midterm was a chair.
Don Mock 6:34
Yeah, which is cool. I love that we’re still doing practical hands, arts and crafts time, you know?
Zoe Mock 6:40
Yeah, yeah.
Don Mock 6:41
Sanding. Drilling.
Zoe Mock 6:42
I mean, speaking of arts and crafts, it’s the biggest insult for an engineer to say I do arts and crafts for a living.
Don Mock 6:47
Really?
Zoe Mock 6:47
Yeah.
Don Mock 6:47
Well, I mean that in a loving way.
Zoe Mock 6:49
No, but I mean, I go to school with people who are gonna go be rocket scientists.
Don Mock 6:52
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 6:53
And for somehow, it’s ridiculous for me to be building the chairs.
Don Mock 6:57
Well, don’t get defensive.
Zoe Mock 6:58
That your people are gonna sit in.
Don Mock 6:59
Yeah, don’t don’t be defensive. I think sitting is important, too.
Zoe Mock 7:02
Complete side note. I am a firecracker, completely full of quote, unquote, piss and vinegar.
Don Mock 7:07
Oh boy. Okay, so back to the topic. We’ve got off topic, as we are bound to do.
Zoe Mock 7:14
Down one rabbit hole.
Don Mock 7:15
Yeah. So nature versus nurture. I guess, you had two creative parents. What about your friends and everybody at school, right? I mean, without naming names and things.
Zoe Mock 7:25
Everyone’s a doctor and a lawyer.
Don Mock 7:27
Well, but I guess the question is, you’re a creative person, brought to you by two creative people. Do you find that is the norm? Do you find that is outside the norm?
Zoe Mock 7:36
For school, now? The institution that I attend now, it’s very, very, not normal.
Don Mock 7:42
Very, not normal.
Zoe Mock 7:43
Very, very, not normal. My school of Industrial Design at Georgia Tech, I will give a lot of credit to them. You know, shout out to them.
Don Mock 7:49
Yes. It’s basically a giant Georgia Tech commercial.
Zoe Mock 7:55
They’re awesome. They’re awesome. They’re great. It’s fantastic. They’re very prestigious. They’re very, very small within Tech.
Don Mock 8:01
Yeah, understood.
Zoe Mock 8:02
As a whole curriculum.
Don Mock 8:03
Well, I think even, we talked about the University of Georgia. We have Georgia grads here that work for us.
Zoe Mock 8:08
Yeah.
Don Mock 8:08
I mean, the College of Design there, is small.
Zoe Mock 8:11
Is pretty small. Yeah.
Don Mock 8:11
So, I went and gave a lecture at Iowa State. Shout out Cyclones. You know, that college of art? I mean, it’s small, you know?
Zoe Mock 8:19
Yeah. There’s pockets.
Don Mock 8:19
Generally speaking, unless you go to an art school, like SCAD, or RISD or things like that, right? You’re going to be the smaller college on campus.
Zoe Mock 8:30
Yes. To tie that back to nature versus nurture, though, I think it’s a little bit of both. I don’t think I would have been as creative as I am without, mommy’s office has every supply I could ever need in the history of ever, for my.
Don Mock 8:45
Yeah, we’ve got all the art supplies.
Zoe Mock 8:46
Third grade art projects.
Don Mock 8:48
Sure.
Zoe Mock 8:48
Just kind of oh, this is so convenient. This is so nice.
Don Mock 8:52
You did have the best solar system model in the class.
Zoe Mock 8:55
We did. There was bent copper wire.
Don Mock 8:57
Yeah, it was pretty impressive.
Zoe Mock 8:58
I don’t know how much of that actually participated in, but.
Don Mock 9:00
You did a lot of it, if anyone’s listening.
Zoe Mock 9:04
But, I think there’s a little bit of both. I don’t think I’d be where I am without the support of being a designer is okay. Because there are still those people and starving artists. And that was never really a conversation because I was not raised by starving artists.
Don Mock 9:18
Yeah, agreed.
Zoe Mock 9:20
But also the sense of like, well, if you want to do this, you’re gonna have to figure out how to do it, and you’re gonna do it well, and sort of, to your point, if you want to do this, why are you not going to be good at it? Which I think is very interesting. And I look at people now where it’s like, I’m just gonna go be an analyst and I’m gonna blah, blah, blah. But kind of the figuring out where I want to go to school. Figuring out what I wanted to do through the years of, one year, I was in five art classes, and blah, blah. I think it kind of sets you up for for more success than not.
Don Mock 9:53
Yeah, I think well, I’m the same way I think. I mean, my parents, I’ve mentioned on the pod that my father is a photographer and I grew up down in the dark room, agitating, dodging and burning all sorts of fun stuff.
Zoe Mock 10:04
Yeah.
Don Mock 10:04
And I think that he had a vision that I might go into the family business. His parents were creative too, and that his father was a florist, right? So, I’ve joked the son of an entrepreneur who’s the son of an entrepreneur, but none of us all went into.
Zoe Mock 10:19
Into the same thing.
Don Mock 10:19
We never took over the family business. I think your mom and I always joke that we were gonna have very accountant driven, mathematically precise children, being the opposite of creativity.
Zoe Mock 10:32
I don’t think you’ve lost that concept, though. I think I’ve chosen a very different form of design.
Don Mock 10:37
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 10:37
And I don’t, I’m not gonna speak into the future of the other siblings.
Don Mock 10:40
Well when I went to school, I mean some of my pals were industrial designers. And loved it. I mean, I love woodworking, I love the whole.
Zoe Mock 10:49
Welding? Metal stuff.
Don Mock 10:51
Yeah, yeah. All that good stuff. It’s, I mean, it’s, it’s remarkable.
Zoe Mock 10:53
Sordering? I will say, industrial design I’m in is very, it’s a lot more technical, a lot less loosey goosey, I would say, than other curriculums I’ve explored, trying to figure out.
Don Mock 11:05
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 11:06
I’m in an electrical class right now. I’m coding and making my own breadboards and Arduinos.
Don Mock 11:12
I know. Blows my mind.
Zoe Mock 11:12
And making things happen. Not to say that other schools don’t make that happen, but it’s very, okay, you’re gonna go to Georgia Tech, like, you’re still gonna have an engineering background to be able to have that speak and understand language in between.
Don Mock 11:24
Listening to you and your Arduino talk. So, our developer Dave would be super psyched. We had actually had an installation here in the office that he had done with his, a collab with his wife, where it was a sculpture that was lit up. And it had motion sensors. And then as you approached it, it would shrink and change colors. Then as you walked away from it, it would expand itself and change colors, right. And it was different color theories. And it was, I believe the sculpture was kind of about the concept of anxiety in a crowd and things like that, it was pretty interesting, right?
Zoe Mock 11:57
That is interesting.
Don Mock 11:57
But, I learned more about Arduinos from Dave at that time.
Zoe Mock 12:00
Yeah.
Don Mock 12:01
And now here you are talking about Arduinos.
Zoe Mock 12:03
Well, I learned Java in high school.
Don Mock 12:06
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 12:06
I’ve never used Java. I had to learn Python for just general Georgia Tech computing.
Don Mock 12:12
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 12:12
And now I’ve learned C++ for Arduinos.
Don Mock 12:14
I know.
Zoe Mock 12:15
That’s taken from everything, I guess.
Don Mock 12:18
Well, we’re gonna get you coding some websites next.
Zoe Mock 12:20
No thank you.
Don Mock 12:22
I don’t blame you. So, I think, not to wrap it up by any stretch, but we can keep talking for forever. The nature versus nurture. What I’m hearing you say is, it’s really more about support, I guess. Right?
Zoe Mock 12:34
Yes. I would agree with that.
Don Mock 12:35
And I would echo that’s kind of how I was brought up as well. Like, because my parents were artistic, there was a level of understanding and support that was like, you can totally do this. And you can totally make a living doing this and all that good stuff, right. So, I think is that fair to say, for the nature versus nurture?
Zoe Mock 12:51
I think that’s fair to say. I don’t, I’m not gonna give too much credit to either side.
Don Mock 12:55
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 12:55
I think people that I’m in classes with and are in my cohort that have two doctors, as parents.
Don Mock 13:02
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 13:03
Are doing just as fine and figured out their path just as well.
Don Mock 13:06
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 13:08
I think that the people like me that had both sides are also doing their part.
Don Mock 13:13
Absolutely. Well, we had a we had one of your old babysitters, one of our nannies. I mean, their a family of doctors, and she came out a graphic designer, right?
Zoe Mock 13:22
Yeah.
Don Mock 13:22
And I remember having conversations with with her dad and it was, obviously, they were very supportive, but there was a level of not understanding, because it’s not the background that they’re from.
Zoe Mock 13:34
Yeah.
Don Mock 13:34
So, I think maybe fair to say that there’s a level of understanding of the background, right, where it’s like, you can totally do this. I totally support. But you also mentioned that you are kind of in this interesting flux. And maybe this is another podcast of digital. You know, I mean, sounds so cliche, the digital revolution.
Zoe Mock 13:52
Sure.
Don Mock 13:53
But there is kind of standardization of certain aspects of life from a design perspective, where you have to, were now hemmed in, right. An example for that might be I mean, we’ve been doing this since before there really were websites, right. So, the web 1.0 was awesome. It was a magical wonderland of all these websites we designed, are like the opposite of user experience.
Zoe Mock 14:20
User friendly.
Don Mock 14:21
Yeah, exactly. It was no, no, no.
Zoe Mock 14:22
Not intuitive?
Don Mock 14:23
The goal is to hide as many buttons as possible, so that people have to spend time on your website to find, it was a fight. It was a search and discovery kind of mission, right? It was fun. And it was experiential. And every website you went to.
Zoe Mock 14:38
It was ridiculous.
Don Mock 14:39
It was totally insane. And everything was hidden and the nav was over here and the nav was over there, or wait a minute, there is no nav, you just have to kind of figure it out. This was back, in the flash days and all that good stuff. Through standardization of the the digital age with mobile devices, I don’t want to say that website design is dead by any stretch, but you are hemmed in with.
Zoe Mock 15:03
There’s a standard.
Don Mock 15:04
Yeah, with the hamburger nav is here. This is how it works. It’s got to work in a one column format on your phone. It’s all about three clicks to the truth.
Zoe Mock 15:11
And that also integrates with accessibility and design.
Don Mock 15:13
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 15:14
And being able to have people understand the patterns from one thing to another.
Don Mock 15:18
Yeah, correct.
Zoe Mock 15:19
Regardless of how they function as a person.
Don Mock 15:21
But also then, which begs the question, if there is a standardization of flow, and user experience, how does your brand stand out from anybody else’s brand?
Zoe Mock 15:32
That’s true.
Don Mock 15:32
Or are you just homogenized in the wash with everybody else?
Zoe Mock 15:35
And this is why you should hire MOCK.
Don Mock 15:37
Thank you. What a great way to end the podcast. Alright, any other thoughts on.
Zoe Mock 15:43
Nature versus nurture?
Don Mock 15:44
Nature versus nurture.
Zoe Mock 15:47
I would say no. I think taking from both sides, if anyone’s listening, and your a doctor or lawyer, have chosen a quote, unquote, standard practice, and you have a child that comes out, wanting to go into design, to understanding.
Don Mock 16:03
Design is awesome.
Zoe Mock 16:03
Understanding and listening.
Don Mock 16:04
Design can change the world.
Zoe Mock 16:05
Design can change the world. Design is changing the world.
Don Mock 16:07
Absolutely. Especially industrial design. I mean, we were more on the brand development and messaging side of design. Where, we haven’t really talked about it, but product design for accessibility is an interesting topic, too. I’m reminded of conversations we’ve had in the past, about IDEO, and the concept of, or even the Stanford D School of you know.
Zoe Mock 16:34
Love D School.
Don Mock 16:35
The minute you put somebody in a wheelchair, they immediately look sick, right? Something’s wrong with them because they’re in a wheelchair, right? So how do you design a methodology, or a wheelchair, for example, from an industrial design perspective that eliminates those biases, and things? I think that kind of stuff, that aspect of design is fascinating, right? So, all right, well, I’m starting to do this with every guest. Because I think it’s kind of fun. Hit me with your favorite ad campaign, or design or something like that off the top your head. Totally putting you on the hot seat here.
Zoe Mock 17:08
I think industrial. Okay, can I can I break it up?
Don Mock 17:10
Yeah, you can do whatever you want.
Zoe Mock 17:11
I’m gonna go industrial design wise, the Eames Lounge Chair.
Don Mock 17:15
Eames chair? Okay.
Zoe Mock 17:15
Absolute favorite thing in the entire world.
Don Mock 17:17
Classic.
Zoe Mock 17:18
That is the same with the Philippe Starck Juicer, because their both so ridiculous.
Don Mock 17:21
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 17:22
Well, I don’t want to say ridiculous. In a way it is.
Don Mock 17:24
Well, I was just about to challenge you, and say the Eames chair, I wouldn’t say is ridiculous. I’d say it’s awesome.
Zoe Mock 17:27
I don’t want to say it’s ridiculous and make that sound negative at all. It’s ridiculous in that.
Don Mock 17:32
It an awesome way.
Zoe Mock 17:33
It’s revolutionary in it’s way. I think that goes the same with Philippe Starck and his juicer, and bioinspired design and that whole new age of changing everything only to be completely cut off by like Andy Warhol and that whole age, and now everything is flat shapes and colors.
Don Mock 17:48
Sure.
Zoe Mock 17:48
And where has life gone? So I would say that industrial design was brand wise and campaign wise.
Don Mock 17:57
Suddenly pops in your head.
Zoe Mock 17:58
All of the memorable ones are like Superbowl campaigns.
Don Mock 18:01
Really?
Zoe Mock 18:01
Because I have that on the mind from.
Don Mock 18:03
Okay, from the beginning?
Zoe Mock 18:04
From the pod and listening to you guys. I would probably have to go oh, actually, no. Now I’m second guessing myself.
Don Mock 18:14
You are allowed to change your mind.
Zoe Mock 18:15
Oh.
Don Mock 18:16
This is riveting radio at home for everyone right now.
Zoe Mock 18:19
I think Avocados from Mexico.
Don Mock 18:21
Avocados from Mexico.
Zoe Mock 18:22
Okay, in terms of in terms of you only see them during the Superbowl time.
Don Mock 18:25
Yeah, you really do. It’s interesting.
Zoe Mock 18:27
I would also.
Don Mock 18:28
I’d be very curious to see what their media plan is.
Zoe Mock 18:30
I mean because the M&M’s are such a hot topic right now.
Don Mock 18:32
Yeah.
Zoe Mock 18:32
M&M spokes candies.
Don Mock 18:34
Spokes candies.
Zoe Mock 18:35
Oh God.
Don Mock 18:36
Alright. Favorite brand? Yeah, anything come to mind?
Oh, this is really putting me on the hot seat. I’m a capitalist. I have so many favorite brands.
Zoe Mock 18:45
Okay, well just hit me with one of the pumps going into mind.
I’m going with Herman Miller.
Don Mock 18:48
Herman Miller. Okay, great brand. Great brand.
Zoe Mock 18:50
Great brand. If they’re listening, I would love to work for them. Actually.
Don Mock 18:54
Well, you still got to finish school first.
Zoe Mock 18:55
Actually Herman Miller. Sidenote IKEA.
Don Mock 18:58
Alright.
Zoe Mock 18:59
I absolutely love IKEA.
Don Mock 19:00
Yeah, IKEA is cool.
Zoe Mock 19:00
IKEA, it’s just so fun.
Don Mock 19:03
Yeah, it’s awesome.
Zoe Mock 19:04
Yes. I when I have a day free, I go walk around IKEA.
Don Mock 19:07
Yeah, I know. You’re like the only person on the planet that actually know that likes to do that and go walk around.
Zoe Mock 19:13
They design furniture.
Don Mock 19:15
Yeah, it’s cool. Well, it’s not only design, but it’s materials and its shipping and its logistics.
Zoe Mock 19:23
And it’s figuring out that whole process. Side note, my chair for my midterm, if you go to my Instagram, Zoe on Mock.design. I’ll plug it at the end for everything, but that chair is entirely IKEA assembled. I didn’t use screws or nails or anything.
Don Mock 19:36
Yeah, it’s all dowels.
Zoe Mock 19:37
It’s all pegs and dowels and dominoes.
Don Mock 19:39
Pretty awesome. Pretty awesome.
Zoe Mock 19:40
So, IKEA could put that in the collection.
Don Mock 19:42
Wow.
Zoe Mock 19:42
If they wanted to.
Don Mock 19:43
Alright. Shout out IKEA. Alright. Alright. Well, thanks everybody. Where can the people find you then Zoe?
Zoe Mock 19:49
ZoeLMock.com for everything.
Don Mock 19:52
Okay.
Zoe Mock 19:52
You know, I’m still looking for jobs and I’m in the.
Don Mock 19:55
Alright, slow down there cowboy. This isn’t a recruiting podcast. ZoeLMock.com
Zoe Mock 20:01
Its my fun little site. I have everything on there and links to my Instagram, to my LinkedIn, to my resume if you want that.
Don Mock 20:06
Fun. Fun.
Zoe Mock 20:06
Some of my current projects.
Don Mock 20:08
Alright, and everybody can find us at mocktheagency.com, on the website, on the socials. Alright, thanks, everybody for listening. We’ll catch you next time.
Zoe Mock 20:16
Thank you.
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